29 August 2006

Black Men / White Women (Revisited)

I've talked about the subject of interracial dating before and until this past weekend, I figured it would be awhile before I brought it back up. Then I found myself at the mall with my family...

My wife and myself and our kids were at a local mall and we stopped in the food court to get some lunch. The county we were in at the time was a majority white county, but there were people of all races walking about and shopping. While we were eating I happened to notice that we were the only Black "nuclear" family that I could see. Now, I'm 100% certain that there were other Black mothers, fathers and children around the mall - but from where I was sitting, all that could be seen were White and Latino nuclear families, us, and several tables with just women and children... and then there were the two tables with Black fathers (husbands) and White mothers (wives) and a total of seven bi-racial kids.

There are several things about Black men and White women that baffle me, but seeing these familes I couldn't help but ponder one specific issue: Do Black men have ANY standards beyond the color of skin when they choose to date White women?

Sure, I assume some Brothers date pretty White women, but the women I saw this weekend, and the vast majority of other White women with Black husbands/boyfriends that I have seen over the years - are largely, unattractive, out-of-shape, and unappealing looking. It's as if these Black men say to themselves, "I want a white woman! I don't care what she looks like as long as she's white! She can be fat! She can be homely! She can be dim-witted! She can be unemployed - JUST AS LONG AS SHE'S WHITE! Gimme' dem White Girlz!"

I, honest-to-God think that is what MANY of these Black men say to themselves. I've run this past my close friends just to make sure I wasn't crazy and they [all Black men] feel the same way I do! All these women have to be is - White. And, the amazing thing is, these Brothers - if they were to ever look at a Sister - they would have a million conditions on her looks: She's gotta be sexy like Melyssa; have thighs like Serena; have eyes like Beyonce; a body like Ki-Toy; and legs like Tina! All this non-sense that is impossible to find in ONE WOMAN! But damn-it if they won't take just any old White woman.

Now, I'm not bashing White women with this commentary, but I am bashing the Brother's that see nothing more than White skin when they go out and choose a girlfriend, or wife or even baby-mama. Frankly I think this shallow, colorcentric desire is pathetic - it is a slap in the face to our women, our mothers, and to those countless Black men that were beaten, tortured and lynched for as little as a rumor that they looked at a White woman.

Meanwhile - the opposite trend is still holding true with regards to White men and Black women. Nine times out of ten, I find myself at a loss for words when I see White men with Sisters. These women tend to be the literal cream of our crop. I very rarely see White men with unattractive Black women. Quite often, our women that they choose are nothing short of stunning.

Now, with all this being said - I do want to put in a small qualifier. I don't think that every Black man with a White woman [as Wife, Girlfriend or Date] has issues against Black women, nor are they all with these women JUST for their skin color. I completely believe that True Love knows no color, and sometimes you just can't control or choose who you fall in love with. So, this commentary doesn't really apply to them. HOWEVER, I think the Brother's who devalue Black women and then so proudly sport White women on their arms, are desperate, sad, and confused individuals.



tickledpinkies said...

Ha thank you very much, lol. Although I have been called lovely and beautiful before but this is another to add to my list;)

I think youd find a similar occurance in Black guys who go for light skinned or mixed race women. As I have said somewhere else the light or mixed race skin is beauty in itself in some peoples eyes.
Its like the situation in India whereby a woman who has pale (white looking) skin is seen as beautiful whether she has a crooked nose, lazy eye and peg leg to boot!

With this kinda thing tho I am mystified. I realise it is shallow minded to say that someone shouldnt like another person because they arent good looking enough but you do see some couples and wonder. Its possible that some of these men dont feel threatened by dodgy looking White women. I saw a docu about IR and there were some BM who dated white and they were saying that when you go out with White woman who doesnt look as nice they try harder in the bedroom and the kitchen (!)
Plus Ive noticed some guys have a less than stunning...ahem.. woman as their main b**ch, wifey(rolls eyes) and then cheat with better looking ones. I suppose they know these women arent going anywhere? Maybe the better looking women have enough White men to keep them occupied? Or possibly if they go out with a less nice looking WW they feel they can be superior in a race way so in effect the WW is lucky to have him not the other way around?


t.HYPE said...

By the same token, I've noticed that a lot of the aforementioned brothas (non-celebrities) really aren't that good looking either. So I'm sure it all works out!

Evia said...

Dag, TBM, I was working here but had to respond. So that was you staring at me when we were in D.C. last month. LOL!

There was this disgruntled brotha who said the same thing when I told him I was going to marry my husband. Nevermind that the brotha had his chance with me before I met my husband. After he found out that my fiance was white, he had the nerve to say, "White men have stolen everything else from us. Now they're stealing our best women!"
This is why I've said before that after black men see enough black women with white men, they will start wanting us again.

And you are so right about most of the white women that black guys choose. Most of the ones I see the younger brothas with in this area are not just a little overweight, they are roly poly FAT and the white women I see older brothas with just tend to be unattractive and dull-acting. Let's face it, most sistas have a lot of sistas have a lot of pizzaz!!

deleted said...

In total agreement!

Four_Inch_Stilettos said...

Thank you for this!

The Thinking Black Man said...

Black1st me second said...

Its possible that some of these men dont feel threatened by dodgy looking White women. I saw a docu about IR and there were some BM who dated white and they were saying that when you go out with White woman who doesnt look as nice they try harder in the bedroom and the kitchen...

That's interesting and may be true, but these Brothers SURE DO look proud when they are out in public- holding hands, hugging, kissing... that just makes me THAT much happier when I see my Brother's showing respectful love to our Sisters.

This may be shallow of me though, but as a man - I'd rather go 40 MPH with an attractive Sister in the bedroom, than 95 MPH with an UNattractive White woman in the same place : )

The Thinking Black Man said...

Evia said,

Most of the ones I see the younger brothas with in this area are not just a little overweight, they are roly poly FAT and the white women I see older brothas with just tend to be unattractive and dull-acting. Let's face it, most sistas have a lot of sistas have a lot of pizzaz!!

Amen- I couldn't be in more agreement with you!!!

I hate to come across like I'm tryin' to diss White women, because that's not my point - but you are 100% right with what you're saying. I am just amazed at these Brother's choices - yet when they turn to the Sister's they got all these 'standards' that have to be met! It's crazy!

BTW- You didn't happen to be sitting on a bench on Pennsylvania avenue with your husband's head on your lap, stroking his hair a few weeks ago? Did you? : )

tickledpinkies said...

That's interesting and may be true, but these Brothers SURE DO look proud when they are out in public- holding hands, hugging, kissing...

Please dont make me laugh my Black ass off right now!
Maybe this is an American thing coz I havent seen it here, or maybe Im just not looking enough. Most of the guys I see with women like that arent gorgeous looking themselves or using them for money.
Im sorry but I dont actually believe you, you talking good looking, decent Black men here??? Holding hands with Raw Dog White women and looking proud??? I need to see this s**t for myself, LMBAO!

Evia said...

To be more fair about this, I don't think we should paint all black men who are with white women with the same broad brush. I believe that some of these guys are interested in or fell in love with women who happen to be white. For those black men, I personally wish them happiness.

On the other hand, I believe there are some black men, who don't necessarily see white women as being more beautiful but still they NEED to be with a white woman in order to feel like they're 'somebody.' Now this is sad, but this is who they need. I wish them happiness too because being with a black woman is NOT going to make them feel like they're 'somebody'--no matter what any of us may say. In that case, ANY white woman CAN give them that feeling of 'somebody'-ness. Whatever their station in life, these men are just very damaged. We all know that this is a sum total effect of white supremacy, but that's how it is. These men express their damage in various ways and this is just another way they express that they're broken inside.

Then there are some black men who simply believe that IR relationships will bring about a color-blind society with less racism. They honestly believe this.

These are the 3 main camps I think about when I think about black men with white women.

This is why I just feel that we black women should just find men who want to be us and as long as black men DON'T BASH black women, I think we should be happy for them--no matter who they're with.

So, to AA men who want to be with white and other women, this is from Evia with love: Love who you want to love, but DON'T BASH AA WOMEN!!

Sean said...


First let me say I am married to a sister. I have had my share of good times and bad times with them in my 40 years but I really wouldn't trade my sisters in for anything under the sun.

I think what happens is we tend to read way too much into IR relationships. Like Evia I don't think that LOVE should have a color requirement placed on it. Now if a brother feels he is somebody being with a white woman I wonder what is going through the white woman's head.

If a white man feels he is now down with the black race by being with a black woman, I wonder what she is thinking.

If I can be ole' school for a minute...in the dark...it is black and can feel the same at times.

Do you think those brothers who had the unattractive white woman thought about looks or love?

Just a question.

tickledpinkies said...

Sorry this is off topic but i just found that forum that has them "pretty" Black guys getting their waves on. There are actually more topics and replies in the "Mens 360 Waves Part 11" than in the AA womens forum. Please take a look at what these guys are saying, I just found out they have to brush for 2hrs on end for 3 months to get those waves!!


The Thinking Black Man said...

Black1stmesecond said...

Im sorry but I dont actually believe you, you talking good looking, decent Black men here??? Holding hands with Raw Dog White women and looking proud???

I have to say that I don't necessarily size these Brother's up - like "He's a handsome Black man..." and just seeing someone on the street or having lunch I can't, you know, say how decent or not decent he is. But a lot of these Brothers seem to have no problem being physically affectionate in public.

Now don't get me wrong - all of these guys aren't falling all over themselves, but a good amount seem very proud!

Go figure...

The Thinking Black Man said...

I agree with Evia's points on "colorblind" love. Most definately I do believe that you can't always choose the color of the person you fall in love with.

If you're lucky, love will creep up on you and take you over before you know what happens - to these people of anyh and all races, my blessings and best wishes to you all!

The BM that say, "Black women have too much attitude..." and the BW that say, "All Black men are dogs..." these people have to get their heads on straight.

The Thinking Black Man said...

Sean said...

Do you think those brothers who had the unattractive white woman thought about looks or love?

I have to say, in my humble little opinion - I don't think so.

Okay, folks that just happened to fall in love with white woman, color not being an issue are a part of my rationale.

But I just think that a lot of these black men with these unattractive white women are probably doing several things, (1) trying to fullfil the foolish notion that having a white woman makes you special; (2) trying to buck the typical social norms AKA being a rebel; (3) using what may be a unattractive woman's possibly low self-esteem to get what he may want from her.

The phenomenon of black men with unattractive white women is SO prevalent that one can only stand up and take notice. I can't believe that it happens to be a coincidence. Either these guys are losers themselves and can't do any better than a homely girl (of ANY race) or they deliberately SETTLE on the first thing white that gives them the time of day.

And, just for the record - I'm not the kind of Black guy that can't see an attractive white woman as An Attractive Woman I can and I do - But one thing is for certain - Homely is Homely regardless of race!

Peace Bro-

Evia said...

Another aspect of white men with black women is that usually when white men of merit hook up with black women, the women are above average (as you've pointed out)in one way or another and sometimes in several ways. It may not be looks sometimes, but of the several black women I know who are married to white guys, the women are talented or very bright or exceptionally creative or skilled or have money or own businesses, or have high status jobs,or are accomplished in one way or the other and sometimes in several of the above.

I'm talking here about white men who are well educated or have money/wealth, or have above average intelligence or status or higher level jobs, etc. Not talking about bummy white guys.

So in a way, the black guy I mentioned above was right when he observed that white guys of merit tend to be with black women who are above average in one or more key ways. And it's perfectly natural for any person to choose a mate who can bring something significant or generally appealing to the table. I'm definitely that way.

This is why I simply don't understand why some black men feel that black women should just accept them even though they have nothing significant to offer.

A black woman is NOT a goldigger just because she wants a man to bring something significant to the table. This is just common sense to me.

Native son said...

Even though I have anever dated a white women, I am not sure when I see the types fo couples you were talking about why they picked the women they are with. I have seen some black couples where I have asked the same question. My sister is a prime example, she is an attractive and she married a brotha who when you stand them side by side, you may ask, "what in the hell was she thinking" lol

I think to truly understand why some brothas picked white women to date/marry we have to actually ask the brothas who are doing it.

The Thinking Black Man said...

You know...

I may just do that.

I'll just walk up and ask.

I'll post what I'm told.

Dave McWhitey said...

I stumbled upon this. I'm a middle class white dude in Seattle. It's not real diverse here in Seattle. My impression of the sisters is that they tend to cop a lot more attitude towards their men "Oh heeeeell no! No you didn't!" Now, white women have the attitude, too. But usually only the good looking/skinny ones at the biotches. I've seen fat, skinny, ugly, beautiful, BW, doesn't matter, I've seen them all have the attitude. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, a lot fat WW are a little more mild because they know they are fat and have to have a nice personality to survive. So maybe the BM are taking on these ugly WW, as mentioned above, because they have to try harder in the bed or the kitchen - and maybe the BM likes not having to deal with the attitude after a night out with his buddies. "Oh no you didn't! OH no you didn't!!"

Dave McWhitey said...

Just that sometimes my ears burn when I hear a sister chewing out her man. I've never seen a woman talk like that. If my woman talked to me like that, I'd kick her ass to the curb! I suppose it's not so much BW or WW, there are some real trailer trash WW beauties that yell and scream but they aren't smart enough to make the words sting. Now a sister, she knows how to make it sting! Ouuch! Gimme a fat WW, I can handle lol

Pearl Jr. said...

Result of Integration Is Just Another Form of Racism
by Pearl Jr.

The only significant result of integration is that Black men can now whistle at, date, have sex with, procreate, and marry White women and that is making my life, as a Black woman, much harder.

The integration of the public school system hasn’t increased the number of Black high school graduates—the dropout rate for African Americans is a whooping 50%, therefore forcing Historically Black Colleges to recruit Latino students to simply add to the declining enrollment. Sitting and eating together with White people hasn’t created more Black owned restaurant, which has dropped 80% since the mid 1960’s. Moving into so-called better White neighborhoods has made Black neighborhoods even poorer and more crime ridden because it took the much-needed role model/provider and protector out of the community. The Negro Baseball League, well it’s defunct, and now non-Blacks own the best of our best athletes. Furthermore, the percentage of successful Black people is the same as it was 100 years ago. Therefore taking all this into consideration, I stand by my statement that the ONLY significant result of integration is that Black men aren’t being lynched because a White woman said a Black man made a pass at her.

Due to the alarming trend of too many Black men abandoning their racial responsibilities in regards to being the provider and the protector of the Black race family, I have vowed to NOT purchase any products by any Black man that is currently spending my money on making sure his non-Black wife/woman lives comfortably. Heck, White men do a good enough job that White women don’t NEED our men to do what their men are most capable of doing. Currently, 60% of Black men who earn more than $100,000 annually (our consumer dollars) are married to non-Black women, to which most of them are highly visible professional athletes and other entertainers who earn millions and influence our youth.

Picture this—the non-Black wives of the few Black millionaires that exist have the best of everything: big house in a gated community, a Mercedes or BMW of her choice, Nanny for their children, much travel and leisure time (jet-setting), no job or income, while the majority of Black women are struggling to pay bills, being the mother and father to her children, attending college so to be the breadwinner, looked upon as the angry Black woman because she is too overwhelmed to be a shrinking violet, and most importantly looked upon as if she is some kind of supernatural he/she man that doesn’t need any acknowledgement of her pains and struggles.

I’m speaking up about this new form of racism. You’re damn right, it’s playa hatin because the game is fixed to go to the White runner and cheating has been going on for far too long. White women have the best PR via the media being honored and rarely disrespected. Contrarily, Black women are bi-at-ches and hos in nearly every hip hop hit, and on nearly all videos.

The Black race is in serious trouble and we can’t afford to have one more sell-out abandoning Black male turn his back on his racial responsibilities without the consequence of losing my Black dollars that support him. Tina Turner had it right, “What’s Love Got To Do With It” when it hurts so badly. Black men with resources mated up with non-Black women will continue the devaluing of Black females, which is connected to lowering the recycling of Black dollars and the abandonment of support for Black organizations.

As I pondered about telling the truth about a few high profile powerful Black men, I realized that I pay their bills and they don’t pay mine. I am no longer supporting them either by watching them on TV or in movies, buying their records, supporting any products they promote, or contributing anything to someone who doesn’t care about my feelings or my plight as a Black woman, which inevitably includes their own Black daughters.

~ Flava Flav is making a fool out of Black women on his new cable show. And to add insult to injury, wasn’t he the front man of the conscious rap group Public Enemy?

~ Nick Cannon from the movie “Drumline” and some other show on a cable network commented in a magazine that he was addicted to White girls.

~ Usher made a flop of a movie chasing a White girl and now that he has a new album, I’m seeing him in anything that targets the Black audience. Now he wants the same disrespected little broken hearted Black girls (his core audience) to forgive and rescue his career by buying his new album, hmmm!

~ Tiger “Cablasian” Woods married a White nanny. Now, we all know if a Black female nanny was just as beautiful as that White woman, he would have never given her a chance. A sistah would need to have a couple of MBA’s, Ph.d’s, MD’s and a trust fund to even be considered. My bad! Nothing would probably help because his words tell me he HATES his Blackness.

~ Kobe Bryant had a myriad of Black girls crying when in an interview he yelled, “you see this ring you can’t have me”, and then was caught on some secret trip to Colorado cheating on his Latino-set for life-wife with a White girl hostess that worked in a hotel lobby who now lives in a mansion, drives a luxury car, and has all the diamonds Kobe’s money can buy because he couldn’t resist the temptation of a 19 year old White girl.

Furthermore, I heard Charles Barkley bragging about him and his White wife hanging with Tiger and his White wife, and Tony Parker with his non-Black girlfriend, Eva Longoria, at a golf course having a wonderful time pretending racism doesn’t exist because they are interracially loving. But in reality their cult to dismiss Black women is the newest form of racism. Do you think these non-Black women want any sistahs around reminding Black men that we need them and their resources because we are dying without them? Hell No! Further influencing these men to pretend Black women and Black race issues are irrelevant in their lives by telling them that race doesn’t matter and they are so glad that racism is over.

Now don’t get me wrong, money isn’t everything, but anyone who wins a million dollars in a lottery would be more than ecstatic and that includes many of us Strong Independent Black women who work their butts off to have happiness despite the world around them.

This integration reality isn’t the dream that Martin Luther King, Jr. prayed for. One of the biggest reasons that the acceptance and the promotion of Black men with non-Black women is because it re-enforces the belief that Black women are only "f*ckable" and not "loveable", which means that an exuberant number of Black children will have a hard road to tow in life because of the reluctant or missing father/role model. The overwhelmed and overstressed Black woman will inevitably be too depressed to make any significant growth for herself and her children and that mental distraction makes it difficult to think clearly and love clearly.

To my beautiful hard-working sistahs, we need more men to assist in our communities because without them to provide and protect, we are headed to hell in a hand basket. The results are in.

To learn what to do about this alarming form of racism against Black women, please order a copy of my book, Black Women Need Love, Too! Exposing the Conspiracy To Keep Black Women Without Love. Available on amazon.com. I connect the dots to several more debilitating occurrences and explain what we can do to stop the bleeding. This is a “how to” book that works!


Check out my website: www.BlackWomenNeedLoveToo.com for further details.

I’ll be debating with Alan Currie the author of, “The Mode” on Saturday, August 26, 2006 at the Beach Bash. This will be a heated, TRUE-TO-LIFE discussion about relationships. Log onto my website for details.

Please feel free to blog this everywhere and pass this around to everyone that you know. If you want to publish this article, please let me know first and don’t forget to link it to my website: www.BlackWomenNeedLoveToo.com

“Black Women Need Love, too!”

The Thinking Black Man said...

Pearl Jr. - welcome to my blog!

Thanks for your comments.

Very insightful! Your points were excellent and there's not much more I can say beyond I agree with just about every word you typed!

Using your economic power as a Black woman to stand against the Brothers who have jumped ship - is an inspirational act. I'm just impressed and I'm sincerely glad you shared your thoughts on my blog. I'm humbled, my Sista.

I'll check your site out and I encourage other readers to do the same!


Peace, and I hope to read you again soon!

Anonymous said...

Could it be that these particular men happened to meet, fall in love with, marry, and have a family with women that don't meet your standard?

Is it certain that these men are with these women becasue they are white?

What about black men married to black women that fit the same description but the women are black? Does that somehow legitimize their love?

I suspect that we spend way too much time thinking about this kind of stuff.

There are larger issues in our communities than meaningless distractions like this.



The Thinking Black Man said...

Hey Gunfighter-

To answer your good questions-

Thanks, dude.

The Thinking Black Man said...

Okay -
To answer GUNFIGHTERS questions a little better - here goes...

Could it be that these particular men happened to meet, fall in love with, marry, and have a family with women that don't meet your standard?

Sure, this is very possible. But I am not the only person that sees this phenomenon. Now don't get me wrong - I believe true love is blind to both color and wide ranges of beauty. But like I said, this occurance of large numbers of black men with generally excepted homely white women is a reality. I think many of these brothers are just glad to be with a white woman.

And I not some colorcentric Brother that can ONLY see pretty in Black women. White women don't have to look like Trish Stratus; Indian women don't have to look like Parminder Nagra; and Asian women don't have to look like Lucy Lu in order for me to think that they are pretty. I can spot a pretty woman and I can spot an ugly woman.

Is it certain that these men are with these women becasue they are white?

They could be with them because they are either skinny or fat too - but my instincts tell me color is the reason.

What about black men married to black women that fit the same description but the women are black? Does that somehow legitimize their love?

To me it means they appreciate a Black woman, they appreciate the shared history, the shared struggle, the shared success of being in the same ethic group. It also means that they realize that real Black women don't always look like Serena or Melyssa Ford.

I suspect that we spend way too much time thinking about this kind of stuff.

We spend either too much or too little time thinking about this.

Personally, I feel the fight for our civil rights is still very fresh. Just 40 short years. There are black men that couldn't even look at a white woman in 1965 who were fighting for the rights we take for granted today. Many of whom are still alive and well. Part of me owes them a debt of honor by not choosing to be with a white woman.

There are larger issues in our communities than meaningless distractions like this.

Well, I wouldn't call it meaningless. I think its important to a lot of people.

If you doubt what I say - check out these two Sista's blogs...


Anonymous said...

Maybe the black men you mentioned couldn't find ANY black woman to date them, so they went where there was a demand. Hey, you gotta do you.

Anonymous said...

There are many comments in this blog that degrade a black man that dates or marries a white woman.It seems that once a black man dates a white woman, he fits a particular mold.I never dated a white woman until later in my life.As a matter of fact, I never considered dating a white woman.I concentrated all my energy in getting myself educated and married a black woman.I wanted to raise a good, decent black family.I hold a double master's, am decently educated in history and is even fluent in more than one language.The poor treatment I received from my wife,her insecutities and even overboard spending habits lead to a divorce.After the divorce, she refused to let me see my own kids even though we shared custody.I have been to court so many times over her refusal to let me visit with my kids that I no longer keep count.Trust me on this,the court is not quick to hold her in contempt.On several occasions, she was ordered to bring the kids to court so I can visit with them for she poisoned the kid's minds against me after the divorce.Are you trying to tell me that I should limit myself to a black woman?I made a point to travel after my divorce.I have been to at least three different continents so far.I have met women of many different races with may different points of view.Again,do you mean to tell me that I should limit myself to a black woman?Some black women seem to be very happy to have a fiancee from a different race and uses every poor excuse to justify it,but resent any black man who does the same.Some people are just too quick to generalize for I am very proud of my black kids and with my education do not feel inferior to no one.

The Thinking Black Man said...

Hello Anonymous -

Hey man, I'm really sorry about the drama your ex-wife put you through.

But should you make all Black women pay for this one Black woman's crimes against you? Hold on - before you fire off an angry return comment. I'm not taking lightly all the BS you went through, and this is a FREE country, I'm just voicing MY opinion. I feel for you man-to-man so keep that in mind.

Yeah, sure some of my comments were degrading to some Black mean that choose to date white women. But my opinions come with certain caveats on this subject. For the Brothers that end up with white [or non-black] wives and girlfriends and their choice was based on things other than the womans race or because of some "issues" they may have with our Black women! To these guys that fell in love for the simple sake of love - I say God-Bless them!

But for Brothers who think Black women are all b*tches or gold diggers or any of a thousand other negative things, and having a Non-Black woman is a step UP from Black women - then HELL YEAH - I'm degrading those punk-@ssed bastards!

I think these guys are sellouts to our race, I think they smack our Black fore-fathers in the face, when there was a time not-to-long ago that Black men where lynched and murdered for even LOOKING at a white woman! For these bastards today, to grab a white woman because of nothing more than their color, or because they think white women are BETTER than black women - you're damn right... I'm degrading these traitors!

Brothers with non-black women, because of non race based love - FINE!

Brothers with non-black women because they think these women are better to have than black women- VERY BAD!

Anonymous said...

Ok, TBM..I respect your points of view on a lot of issues. Some I agree with, some I disagree with, and when I do, I will try do with civility.

This is a free country, so I have the right to date whomever I wish. The reasons and motives behind that decision frankly are no one's business. Just because I have black skin does not give a black woman title and deed to me, nor does it me to her. We all have the freedom and power to make our own choices regarding such a crucial life's decision.

I have no problem with those who are opposed to IR dating. i'm well aware that not everone will agree with mixing of the races, and that's fine. I do, however have a serious issue with those who are ignorant, disrespectful and spend way too much time analyzing them, especially in a public setting.

For heaven's sakes..don't people have anything better to do than wonder why a white woman that is deemed unattractive is with a black man? Last time I checked, there are a lot of "homely" looking sistas as well..We all know not very sista looks like Beyonce, and not every white woman looks like Catherine Zeta Jones or Angelina Jolie either.

On the same token, I'm sick and tired of the double standard when it comes to IR dating in the black community. It seems it's ok for black women to bash brothas and date white men, but it's not ok for a brotha to date outside the race, lest he be stamped a "sellout".

So TBD, all due respect, it's NOT just the brotha's doing this.

Oh, and Pearl Jr. I respect your opinions, but I suggest you do some research regarding high profile sista's who have "crossed the line" before you go bashing the brothas who have.

Politically Incorrect White Woman tellin it like it is! said...

What about the black men that those white women are married to or dating? Are they all that? Most black men that I know are not extremely handsome. Many are moderately good-looking, but most fall below that line.

So what's the biggie if a less than good-looking black guy hooks up with a plain jane white girl, or even a borderline ugly one?

It's not as if he would have his pick of the cream of the crop amongst black ladies, and his white wife/girlfriend probably couldn't land a good-looking, successful white man and that is why she chose him, an ordinary black man.

On the otherhand, look past external beauty, it's only skin deep and fades as the years pass anyway. Perhaps they are with each other coz they genuinely love/like each other? Ever think about that?

In my case I'm a good-looking white woman who is very intelligent and dynamic, although not materially wealthy. However, my black boyfriend fancies himself as very handsome (he is handsome but not quite as hot as he thinks he is).

He feels that he can get almost any woman he wants because he's so charming and a BMW (black man working), which is rare in his neighborhood, so he fancies himself a catch for almost any woman.

On top of that he prefers black women because he's into that pan-African stuff - black superiority and the like.

So why is he with me?

Even I have no idea!

We met, became friends and now we are living together, but honestly, in the back of my mind I feel he would prefer to be with a successful, smart and beautiful black woman. He says he's happy with me and doesn't want anyone else, but really, I find that hard to believe and my self-esteem is taking a nose-dive with him.

On top of that I'm older than him and he kind of cops an attitude that I should be grateful to have a young, handsome guy like him, whom any woman would be happy to have.

Get real!

In my opinion he should be happy to have a woman with my brains, morals and character. He sure couldn't find such quality women in his own neighborhood! And if he's so hot, how come I don't see any women breaking down our door to steal him away from me?

Talk about ego!

Men - it pays to appreciate the women you are with. She will not bad mouth you on internet blogs if you do.

Anonymous said...

^^It seems to me you are not only desperate but stupid as well. If you "feel" this man is not with you sincerely than why are you wasting your energry on him? I won't waste anymore time on you seeing as though white women like you always have to comment about your life without actually understanding the topic at hand. Black women are at a disadvantage when it comes to dating. Everyone knows this. People continually point out that men are interested in us. How can this be? If black men are not interested in us, then how in the world can other men of color or not be interested as well? Asian men are having the same problem. Black men are pursued and black women are discarded as garbage. I am 21 years old, and do you know how many times I have been called unattractive simply because I am brown skinned? I also wear my hair natural. The woman I am today seems to repel men. When my hair was relaxed a few black men would approach me. Now that I accept who I am, it is as if the men do nothing but roll their eyes in disgust. I know I should be out having fun and enjoying the time of my life, but dating to me is part of the experience. I want to experience that, but I am afraid I never will. To top it off, I often get told I resemble India Arie. I think she is a beautiful woman, but many people I know feel she is homely looking. To know that my community is falling apart, and interracial relationships are not helping solve our problems hurt. To know that I am already deemed ugly because I am not light skinned or white with long flowing hair hurts. To know that I will probably die old a spinster hurts like hell. This pain I am feeling is killing me inside. I swear I have thought about suicide so many times, but I can't go through with it. I don't even want to try anymore. I just don't. I am so tired of being part of a group of people who just don't get it. I am tired of the self hating, racism, racial jokes and stereotypes pertaining to us, and the statistics whites love to point at as truth. I am tired of it all. I wish there was a machine where you could throw in your black card and then become invisible. I'm pretty much fed up with black people period. We can do so much better than this, but we don't even try. We love taking the easy way out of things, and to me IRs are in the same boat.

Forgive me for this, but I believe black women will be led to three things. Lesbianism (for some this is already an option), spinster hood, or suicide. Me I've only looked at the two and three. Interracial dating is NOT an option for me. How do I know those men won't use me for sex, or call me a nigger in a heated debate? How do I know that he won't abandon me if we were to get married and I have his child? I'd rather be alone than be with a man who is not black with a good character. Just me I believe. My opinion. Peace.


Woman to Woman said...

Well Styles, why don't you hang out at NOI meet-ups or other African centered religious places. There are plenty of those, escpecially in the Northeast. Because there are alot of black men out there that will only date and marry black women, and black women who are proud to be black. In fact, my fiance was a part of those for years, and that is why I feel that deep down in his heart he feels a little guilty being with me, a white woman - although he will deny that.

African-centric organizations - whether religious or not, tend to be filled with black people who want to mix primarily with other "conscious" black people, so I'm sure you would be able to find plenty of black men there to date.

You are still so young - only 21. It's a little too early to be worried about spinsterhood. Maybe you just need to be more pro-active and make a conscious effort to seek out those placea where African-centric black men hang and congregate. For every black man with a non-black woman, there is a black man who will ONLY BE WITH A BLACK WOMAN. All you need to do is meet men like that and take your pick.

And you are wrong to assume that if a black man does not want you, no other man will. There are plenty of non-black men who find black women attractive and are dating/marrying them. But you have resolved to only date a black man. Therefore you will have to be more pro-active in finding a black man who exclusively wants a black woman.

Think positive. Make a list of the qualities you want in a mate and then attract him into your life via the LAWS OF ATTRACTION.

He is out there. Go get him.

And if not, maybe Powers That Be have a higher calling for you in life. Maybe you are meant to do something for the world and not just one man.

Either way, the glass can be half-empty or half-full, depending on how you see it.

Anonymous said...

Watch it with the broad brush. The truth of it is that black woman are responsible for most of the lack of interest from some black men. Let's keep it real. I'm 39 and if I see an attractive black female my peer they are usually to concerned with their image to recognize a decently dressed man,a proffesional, with an eye on reality. If we want to use general stereotypes. "Shaquida's got too many babies ,not enough education, and watches to much BET .Oh yeah too many ex fathers also.No race is a slam dunk, but don't hate me because I want someone who is worthy of me no matter what the color.I won't settle just so you won't call me an uncle Tom.

Colleen B. from Savannah, GA said...

Dear Thinking Black Man,

I'm sure you see plenty of unattractive black women with black men, but, for obvious reasons, the IR couples attractiveness (or lack thereof) sticks out more in your mind. You obviously are looking for any reason to immediately denigrate any IR couple you see, so, you've gone for the most shallow and immature reasoning possible. Judging the validity of an interracial couple (or any couple)on the physical appeal of the woman isn't much of a leap from judging the merit of a couple based on skin color.

The fact that you notice that the white women you see with brothers are usually less than perfectly attractive points to the idea that YOU have put white women's beauty on a pedestal; NOT that black men will shag anything with light skin.

There is a double standard when it comes to body size between white and black women. A black woman with a big butt and thick thighs is shapely, sensual, and desirable. A white woman with a big butt and thick thighs just has a fat ass.

When you complain that brothers are dating white women who are fat and ugly, am I to concur that your argument is, "If brothers are gonna date others, she'd better look like a supermodel!" Would black men with gorgeous white women ease the pain you feel for the black woman who is "left behind"?

Oh, but not all the black women are left behind. You complain that all white men have snatched up all the good looking black women. Are you saying all the black women "left" for black men to date are are less than beautiful?

Why don't you get to know some IR couples -ugly or beautiful- before you presume to understand what their relationship is based on.

Your argument really very racist AND misogynistic.

Looking for Love in all the Wrong Places said...

Another issue might be "class".

My fiance was raised in a mixed suburb and attended private school, mostly white. He is black. After that he went to live with this birth mother in the 'hood and was surrounded by crime and uneducated people with whom he found it hard to relate. The educated and professional black women he might throughout his career were either married, gay, conceited (proud), or otherwise not approachable. It was either them (not available), the 'hood girls (not cultured), or an internet search.

It's not easy to find someone who you feel is your intellectual equal and with whom you feel compatibility. Cut these men some slack.

Anonymous said...

I have read some of this jealous non-sense from a lot of stupid people about race relations, and I decided to post a comment. There is no way you can analyze why a man chose one woman over another, whether she is white or black. How someone can say stereotypically that white men choose talented or extraordinary black women is the height of stupidity on some Black woman's part. As if white men are the ones doing the choosing in the first place. Black women are pushing themselves on white men. Is it because white men look better, they respect her more, they are better fathers ( who fathered more illegitimate children with black women than white men, and then sold them to avoid taking care of them)? No, its money plain and simple. When a woman's charms are for a price, then she is a prostitute plain and simple. Those who dress up the prostitute-like money factor, by saying they want a man to bring something to the table, I ask, what do you bring to the table beyond legs that can open? All of this talk of unattractive white women is strange to me also because who says that the Black women who push themselves on these white men are attractive or talented, but one of these Black-women-worshipping-Oprah-loving-blackman-hating Black women? Why don't you think that White people in general find these same women as unattractive as you find their white women? All I've really read is some silly Blackman hating woman who probably lost many men with argumentative foolishness. I'll tell you why so many Black men are leaving Black women, in fact white men are beginning to treat black women as nothing but sex toys to throw away after one use, your crappy attitudes. If you have had to tolerate a person who argues for entertainment, argues as a form of communication, who acts like she really needs her butt kicked every other hour to act like a human being, once you find the first person of the opposite sex who even remotely acts human, and treats you like one, and not just something that 'brings something to the table' when you bring nothing but a hard time, then that's what brings out this open affection in any human being. To get treated like a human being for once, by one of the opposite sex is like nothing else in this world, and maybe that's why they are not ashamed to walk hand in hand, or to fondle publicly. I'll say this as a Black man who is married to a Black woman, and knows personally no other Black man married to anyone other than a Black woman; our Black women, my mother included, treat Black men like crap. No other woman in the world is nearly as harsh, rude, argumentative, and just plain bitchy to her man like a Black woman, with Hispanic women and white English women tied at second. The whole world knows it, and comments on it regularly. This is another reason why any one of these non-Black women can nab the average Black guy with relative ease. If Black women were really nicer, not their version of nice, but really nicer to Black men on average, a lot of the relationship issues that our race seems to be stuck on would be over in about 2 months.

White Queen of Black King said...

I've never really been aware of the tension between black women and black men or of the tension surrounding inter-racial couples until I became involved with a black man. Then I started reading sites on the net regarding these topics and was pretty shocked at how jealous and venemous women can be towards other women. We are a sisterhood and should stick together, or so I thought. There are several sites on line by moderately attractive (but by no means gorgeous), large black women who extol the virtues of their curvaceous, voluptous figures, while asserting that white women of the very same size are just "fat" and "ugly". Guess what? Most of us (including most black women) do not look as hot as Angelina Jolie. Most women are simply "cute", "pretty", "moderately attractive", or just "ok". And that goes for all you "curvy" black women out there too. The white women black men are with are not any more or less attractive than you, in most circumstances, and most likely, are not any fatter either. Moreover, the black men that we white women are with are not usually Denzel Washington look-a-likes with great, successful careers that take them to exotic locations and loads of cash. We are ordinary people, as are you. So why all the hate?

It seems that many black women present themselves as being "desperate" for men, which is a set-back for all of us (women) by like 40 years. We don't NEED men, we need air and water to survive, men we simply "want". By presenting yourself as a "begger" for men looks bad for all of us. Have some dignity.

I've also noticed that many black women on the web define themselves in contrast to non-black women. For example;


Can take a week of left over scraps
and make a gourmet meal
Can cuss a man out, then make love to him
that night and make him feel like a king.
Can wear a burgundy french roll, 3 inch heels
and a split up her thigh to work and
make it look professional

Can wear the hell out of spandex
Can raise a doctor, a world class athlete
and an A+ student in an environment
deemed by society as dysfunctional,
broken underprivileged And disenfranchised.
Can heat a whole house in the winter
without help from the gas company.
Can go from the boardroom to the block
and "keep it real" in both places.
Can slap the taste out of your mouth.

Can put a Black man and his non-Black date
on pins and needles just
by walking into the room.
Can live below poverty level
and yet set fashion trends
Can fight two struggles everyday
and make it look easy
Can make a child happy on Christmas day
even if he didn't get a thing
Can be admired and fantasized
about by men of other races
Can be 75 years old and look 45.

Can make other women want
to pay plastic surgeons top
$$$ for physical features
she was already born with.

can be the mother of civilization.

Author unknown

I can do everything on that list except for the following...

Can put a Black man and his non-Black date
on pins and needles just
by walking into the room. "....

.....because when I walk into a room I endeavor to make others feel just as confident as I am.

If you are really all that, you can stand on your own without having to take jabs at other women via poetry. Real Queens command respect rather than demand it.

zara said...

I have got a russian gal and im married to her. We i am an indian from the southern part, and im dark skinned. having a wonderful lyf....

Mz said...

I just have to leave a comment because almost all of you sound like a bunch of over educated privileged spoiled brats. I am a WHITE WOMAN absolutely head over heels for a young black man. He is from the hood, and very attractive to white and black woman alike. He is charming, smart as a whip and sensitive. I am the first white lady he has been in a relatioonship with and, his oppinion is, he won't go back to a black woman, no matter how beautiful, because they treat him like garbage. Never appreciating a hard working black man catering to her and taking care of her. Never satisfied, is what I see and most of us do to.
If u black woman would get a clue as to what you have, you might be able to keep it.
I treat him like my king, the king he is, as he deserves to be treated, and I get the respect, love and loyalty only a black man can give. He makes me feel so special...no white man has ever made me feel as good about myself
So all you who wanna talk alot of junk about white/black...be in the situation before throwing stones.

christelle said...

hi every body i m very glad to read this because i thought that i was the only personn to that there is a problem i m french and we do have the same problem ,could somebody telling me what s going on.TOO many black women are single while our stupid black men are dating with those f..... ....... women

God's Adopted said...

I am a Black man that's married to a wonderful White female. I'm well-read and well-bred...from the not-so-good side of the tracks. But anyway, she's gorgeous, can definitely take an old meal and make it look, smell and taste new...even though we don't even have to. We've stuck it out through the thick and thins of life and she's NEVER complained or left. We are both saved and filled with the Holy Spirit and found God together some years ago. Now we're having a little boy...IN WEDLOCK.

So, I don't care what is said about interracial dating/marriage/relationships. You can call me, a Black Man, stupid for dating and marrying someone that I love...but what are you doing...outside of griping about someone else's happiness?

You spend all day hating...and I bet you call yourself "God's child". Do you see the inconsistency there?

breathnstop said...

i just cant help thinking that those same black men you saw at the mall with their not so attractive white wives and children would be the same guys you would see with a not so attractive black woman and their children....they are just family type guys who hang in there when their wives got fat after they had kids...they are just family oriented guys...the ones who you didn't see at the mall who had obviously produced the other families were the ones chasing after the illusive perfect white or black ass, like kim kardashian or beyonce, because they are too insecure and immature to stay with their families and do the right thing...i was very pretty and white when i married my very handsome husband who is black in 1979 with a killer shape: i ended up having two ten pound babies by cesarian and while i was still pretty and my ideal weight, i never again had a flat stomache. my husband said he didn't care, his babies came from that scarred up, stretch mark stomache and he loved me anyway. was he a "sell out" or just a good husband?...

God's Adopted said...

Well, there tends to be a lot of "profiling" going on in society today; much of it being conceived from a onslaught of ignorance. More specifically, it tends to come out of a society that finds great pleasure and accomplishment in exagerrating some statistics that they have gathered objectively (on the internet) or subjectively (at a mall full of interracial couples).

Saying that Black Men who date White Women only date the White Women at the "lower end of the sexy tree (maybe the trunk of the tree)" is very unfounded. I'd like to see some concrete, unbiased, published research documentation on that if anyone has it:-)

Also, saying that Black Men who date these inaptly surnamed "bottom-dwelling" White Females do so only because there is a need to feel validated by them or rather to be treasured by another human being and to be treated like some type of, dare I say, person sounds very nice...but is really unfounded. Anybody got any psychological research abstracts from the American Journal of Psychology handy to prove me wrong??

To assume that there is a specific reason as to why ALL interracial couples are together is quite honestly...stupid. It's like saying that all Black Men are horrible fathers. My father was a great father to all four of my brothers and sisters (none were step sisters). He had one wife and one mother to all of his children. We went to church on Sunday and had house Bible study on Wednesday. We never were hungry, without clothes, without love.

It’s also like saying that ALL Black Women are in the projects with five kids from five different “baby daddies”. My mother is in nursing, my youngest sister is an RN, my middle sister is a Literacy Coach with a Master’s Degree in English, and my oldest sister is a Forensic Scientist. Hmmm…I guess that breaks that “Black Women Theory” down huh?

Or it could also be like saying that ALL Black male children grow up to be drug dealers with platinum teeth who spend too much time on their old cars jacked up ten feet into the air. I don’t know about you all, but I drive a Chevrolet Impala with no rims and no tint that gets serviced every three thousand miles cause I don’t have the time to.

So “profiling” by using what you’ve seen in a mall somewhere is not accurate. Furthermore it is a very ignorant, narrow-lens view of life.

In all things, an always is never considered an always until there is absolutely no way that it can be disproved. And I'm certain that EVERY theory about why Interracial couples are Interracial couples are horrifically wobbly.

Spend more time updating your minds with some substantial things, people... instead of becoming the "minor birds" of your ancestral slave masters; hating the same things they do just because they do.

RideThisBlackCowboy said...

As a 56-year-old,5-9,218-lb.Brad doll-from 1970-'72,Bra was Barbie's boyfriend Ken's
handsome black buddy,OF COURSE,I can't resist a buxom blonde-her bra,36D-42D be-
tween 25 and 39,because a great-looking black lad and hot white lass are a telegenic couple.(There are also FAR TOO MANY fat,fugly,b***hy black broads!!!!)

brotherspeak said...

Thinking black man...

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Concerned American said...

I think this article portrays the same stereotyping that we have been vicitimized by as a people for years. I am sure there are some good looking black men and ugly white women; however there are some good looking black men with ugly black women also.If you love someone you should be proud to be with them no matter what they look like. Your arguement says that if I am with my wife an she is somehow disfigured that I should no longer walk with her as if she is the most attractive woman in the room.I think that you should always think that the person you are with is superior to any other woman around. Also you are taking the heat off the Black woman by assuming that she has not played a part in the brother going the other direction.Don't get me wrong,I think the article is entertaining.However,it scares me when we subscribe to stereotypical views. Of course you notice the black guy with the ugly white woman because it stands out. The problem is the same logical process is used to say blacks are criminal or intellectually inferior because those who are stand out.

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Freddy said...

I think allot of black men date white women as a in your face honky statement. I gots yo HO Honky!